[13:16:53 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hey
[13:26:03 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: hey my name is Lucas and i want to ask some questions about main requirements for application, currently i haven't microphone to speak with You so we need to do some text chat.
[13:26:24 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i look at hubshout.com and i see that this app is using mainly
[13:26:30 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: highchart library
[13:26:30 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Sure
[13:26:46 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes its showing everything in graphs.
[13:28:01 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: few days ago i have ended similar project that has the same box layout and technology
[13:28:19 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: all data was splited into several content boxes
[13:28:32 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes I think its using HighChart Library itself.
[13:28:33 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Right
[13:28:35 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and dynamically and asynchornically fetch data from specific endpoints
[13:28:58 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Right
[13:29:26 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: so basically this project will be based on google analitics data
[13:29:37 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and adwords Yes?
[13:29:47 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes for the SEO Panel - Google Analytics and Adwords - YES.
[13:30:25 CEST] Nikhil Jain: it might also use some SEMRush.com things or Compete.com things to show competitors data may be (I am not sure about this)
[13:30:30 CEST] Nikhil Jain: For PPC Panel it might interact with just the adwords and might use show some competitors data as well
[13:31:02 CEST] Nikhil Jain: For Social Tab I am not sure what are they using, they basically show all the social mentions (from twitter, facebook etc) for the clients social pages
[13:31:36 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and do You want to show data in real time or agregate it to database and show users with some delay like 24h?
[13:33:19 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: if You could look at http://staging.pickgrapevine.com/
[13:33:35 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: for username: tomasz.jackowski
[13:33:38 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: for password maslo11
[13:33:48 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: *tomasz.jaskowski
[13:34:50 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I am looking at it right now.
[13:35:02 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I think showing with 24 hours delay should also be fine if that saves a lot of our work.
[13:35:48 CEST] Nikhil Jain: What is this website all about? I am already seeing everything related but may be you can explain things better?
[13:35:48 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: mainly the reason why we should aggregate data in some sort of queue is rather cpu usage
[13:36:13 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: when we delay data processing
[13:36:22 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: the page will definitelly loads faster
[13:37:12 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: so the grapevine app that i show You is aggregationg data from social networks
[13:37:25 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and present them to customers
[13:37:47 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: they could watch for every reviews
[13:37:58 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: that clients send to them
[13:38:10 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: some boxes has chart icon
[13:38:24 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: so the data can be present in tabular and graph mode
[13:38:49 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and there is the competition tab
[13:39:08 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: where user can compare company with other competitors
[13:42:48 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Sorry I was talking to anna
[13:42:52 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes let me read now
[13:43:14 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: ok i understand
[13:43:23 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Right exactly.
[13:43:48 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So yeah it would be fine if we update data in 24 hours and not do it in real time
[13:44:20 CEST] Nikhil Jain: as our users will not be TOO MANY, we might be having only a handful of clients may be less than 5000 Users in Total
[13:45:00 CEST] Nikhil Jain: or may be something like that even at a later stage..! But yes they could be more.. but I am saying there would not be a LOT of users using the system at the same time may be
[13:45:04 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So it shoudl not be that much a problem.
[13:45:17 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And yes I like what Grapevine is doing
[13:46:16 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So this Grapevine you had developed?
[13:46:23 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes
[13:46:29 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i was the lead developer
[13:47:43 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: but i was doing all sort of frontend issues like ajax, jquery, charting, ui and processing data from server
[13:48:34 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: in next stage i integrate app with facebook and twitter
[13:48:43 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: for social activity box
[13:48:59 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and social update box that allows to browse and send updates for linked accounts
[13:49:01 CEST] Nikhil Jain: to get all the social mentions?
[13:49:23 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes
[13:50:24 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I am not exactly sure how HUbShout people are doing it
[13:50:40 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But you may want to check some demos and site tours from their website to understand better what they are doing
[13:50:42 CEST] Nikhil Jain: like check this - http://hubshout.com/?WEBINAR----HubShout-SEM-Portal-Version-2.0-Preview&AID=294
[13:50:43 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: generally we show posts published on facebook wall and twits that user have but facebook and twitter api has more usefull tools
[13:51:20 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I think this video will explain everything that their system does (I think it will talk about every tab)
[13:53:41 CEST] Nikhil Jain: That is a 1 hour demo haha! So it will actually explain everything is very detail.
[13:54:47 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and You want to have something very similar or with reduced functionality?
[13:56:07 CEST] Nikhil Jain: May be we want to delay the Email and PPC and Sales Tab to a bit (they can come a bit later) but for SEO and Social Tab I might want to have everything.
[13:56:36 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But what do you think if we want to build up this COMPLETE system (everything that you see) then what would it take for us to make it?
[13:56:46 CEST] Nikhil Jain: how much time and what kind of cost could we think
[14:07:18 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: we need to split this application into two parts - backend that will handle the data agregation from google analitics etc. and frontend that will present the whole processed data to users. I think that integration of analitics and other data sources may take up to 400h on the other hand frontend can be coding parallel and the amount time shoud be about 200h. So for first estimation 600h should be the amount that should be highly probably to have it finished in time.
[14:08:54 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: of course we need to specify main modules for application like registration, authentication, agregation, and the frontend javascript part
[14:11:12 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i think that to the end of this day i should plan it in details because it was very fast calculation and i might miss something or overcalculated
[14:11:33 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hmm
[14:13:12 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: if You could give me Your email so i will send the overall calculations
[14:13:29 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Sure - [email protected]. You can email me all the details here.
[14:13:35 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: ok
[14:15:39 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: thank You for the conversation i will try to analyse the hubsout app in more details
[14:15:51 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And how much does your comapny charge per hour?
[14:16:15 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes you can surely analyze it in detail with the Video link I gave you (1 hour video). That will clear up everything in your mind.
[14:16:53 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: You need to talk with Anna because she is respond for this part as a account manager
[14:21:22 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Okay
[14:24:20 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So I shoud expect an email about the proposal from you by today?
[14:24:47 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And you are sure you can make this happen with great qualtiy?
[14:30:01 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Let me explain you a bit more story about the background of our company and how this system had to be before.. and may be that way you can recommend a better solution
[14:30:50 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Go to SubmitEdge.com and register an account with them, so that you would be able to view their panel from inside.
After that Check this:
================================
URL : http://www.iwisinfotech.com/submitelite/adminPanel/
================================
Admin Login:
Username : [email protected]
Pass : admin123
================================
Manager Login:
Username : [email protected]
Pass : test123
================================
Employee Login:
Username : [email protected]
Pass : emp123
================================
You may open these in 3 different browsers so that you can view all of these in one go.
So basically we are a SEO Company. Look at SubmitEdge.com home page, whatever services you see in their left hand sidebar we will provide all those services. So like you see at every page there is a Buy Now button and the customers can buy the products (its basically a shopping cart system). So basically a shopping cart system...!
Like this we will be having various services whatever you see at SubmitEdge.com right now (we would have all of them and in a similar Shopping Cart Fashion)
Also we would be having a lot of Employees who would actually perform the work for the clients. Everything would be automated..! Like the moment someone makes a purchase on the website and makes a payment for it, we would get his order details in the panel (Admin, Manager and Employee - ALL would be intimated).
So basically Manager will then check the order details and then assign tasks to various employees. Manager as the word tells would be kind of head after the Admin. There could be 3-4 Managers and could be 100's of Employees. Managers could be more too.
So after manager assigns a task to the employee, the employee will start the work after completing the work he will submit the reports in the panel which will automatically go to the manager for review and once he approves that it will go to the client directly.
So I already had a PHP Programmers Team who was working on this project ... at that point of time I had asked them to create a COPY of SubmitEdge.com system and that system does manages all that part.
Its just that the panel that you are seeing right now is a Client Panel
But the Admin, manager and Employee panel you do not see right now.
But it would be all there as well right? So as per our convenience we had made out all the specifications for the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel
So my PHP Programmers have already completed the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel so far according to them (I haven't checked too much of it yet).
But this SubmitEdge system just talks about the orders, clients can only see the orders, and download reports may be. But later I landed up at HubShout where they talk about all the rankings and everything and all the analytics for their clients.
So I was asking my team of programmers to do this HubShout thing for me as well. But I don't think they have any kind of experience doing that kind of stuff.
They are just PHP Programmers and don't have any knowledge about SEO at all and have never worked with these analytics APIs etc before.
In fact they have never even worked with any particular framework before..! THey just know a bit about CakePHP and Zend Framework! But they are not PROs at it.
For SubmitEdge kind of thing I was okay to have them (and you can also see the login details I gave you the kind of system they have developed) - I THINK it looks decent ?
Right now they haven't developed the client side at all. I had got the work paused for a while.
So as hubshout is also included now.. I am thinking to change my programmers team.
-----
So basically Employee, Manager and Admin Panel might be almost complete! But so as to make integrations of HubShout Panel we might need to do a lot of changes in the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel too.
So now I hope you have understood at what stage I really am and what do I need from you.
[14:30:53 CEST] Nikhil Jain: BTW How are you liking the system my old programmers have made? Have they coded things well? does the system look great? All the 3 Panels - Admin, Manager and Employee
[14:43:13 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Are you still around? did you read all this above?
[14:47:39 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i am still here, i will reply when i finish analysing Your app
[14:49:51 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Okay, read all that I wrote above as well.
[14:52:27 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i can't login to employee account
[14:53:53 CEST] Nikhil Jain: May be there is some problem. Do not worry about that. In that the person can just view the tasks assigned to him
[14:54:05 CEST] Nikhil Jain: and he will start all the work which is done offline - not in the system.
[14:54:15 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Later he just uploads the reports in excel file in the system and thats all.
[14:55:22 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: So You are saying that this app was created without any framework only in plain php?
[14:55:51 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes the panels that you are seeing (my panels) were created without framework.
[14:56:00 CEST] Nikhil Jain: SubmitEdge is not my website
[14:56:03 CEST] Nikhil Jain: so I am not sure what they have done.
[14:56:10 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes i am talking about Yours
[14:57:13 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes they are without framework
[14:57:47 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: the problem with coding in php is that it can be really painful when we don't keep any coding standard, because is could be very hard task to extend app functionality
[14:58:19 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: any thats why frameworks are the way that programmers could do programming tasks faster
[14:58:47 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and applications becames easy to extend because we have some collection of reusable components
[14:59:05 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: and when we use plain php we have to build everything from scratch
[14:59:26 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Yes I understand that and I know that. And I did tell this to my programmers but it turned out they had never worked in a framework before so they wanted to work in Plain PHP
[14:59:44 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I did asked them all the time that I would like to develop it in CakePHP
[15:00:05 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But later we finalized that we will have the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel in Plain PHP and Client Panel in CakePHP
[15:02:06 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i have great experience with Symfony framework, one of the best frameworks for PHP, and i must say that it is greatly improved the quality of code
[15:02:14 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So I mean if you suggest I can get the complete SubmitEdge.com system done with them as I had agreed with them before and then I can give you incharge of all the furhter system (that will include all the HUbShout Funcationliaty) and that will also involve changes in Admin, Employee and Manager Panel to cope up with the Client Panel (which you will do) OR you can develop all the client system by your own (including SubmitEdge Functionality as well, Payment Gateway Integration etc) and make changes in Admin, Employee and Manager Panel
[15:08:58 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: so if i understand correctly i have two options. first to extend the existing application and adding Hubshout functionality or to build everything from scratch yes?
[15:10:03 CEST] Nikhil Jain: the 2nd option does not include everything from scratch. In 2nd Option you would continue building client panel from scratch yes. But the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel you will continue from what stage it is right now.
[15:10:32 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes i was only targeting client panel
[15:10:42 CEST] Nikhil Jain: The 3 Panels that you see currently.. have a lot of functinoalies of task management etc which has already been worked at. How are did you like all of that BTW?
[15:11:18 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And how much do you think is all the Manager, Admin and Employee Panel worth in terms of time or money? The way it is done
[15:15:34 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: the ui of this 3 panels looks easy and from outside the application looks quite attractive.
[15:16:13 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hmm nice!
[15:16:28 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And do you have an idea on how much time would it have taken if it was done by you?
[15:16:52 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I know it would depend a lot on functionalities and you might not understand them well right now. .but still an idea if anything comes to your mind?
[15:16:53 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i don't know the whole specification of particular panels
[15:17:04 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hmm yes, but still an idea?
[15:17:10 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: hmm
[15:19:23 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i think that manager panel i would made not faster than 1-2 months
[15:20:26 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hmm
[15:20:37 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So you mean something like 150 hours?
[15:20:48 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes
[15:21:06 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Just the manager or that includes Employee and Admin Panel too?
[15:21:36 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i can't login into Employee panel so i don't estimate it
[15:21:43 CEST] Nikhil Jain: and the Admin?
[15:23:58 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: what are the differences between admin and manager panels?
[15:25:23 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Hmm yeah there is not much difference.
[15:25:37 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Manager Panel basically just does not has some abilities to perform
[15:25:51 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And infact there is not so much difference with Employee System either
[15:27:22 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: ok so we can assume that this app could be redeveloped in period of 3 months
[15:27:52 CEST] Nikhil Jain: With HubShout Functionality?
[15:28:01 CEST] Nikhil Jain: a Client Panel and the updated Admin and Employee Panel?
[15:28:14 CEST] Nikhil Jain: and Updated Manager panel too
[15:31:00 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: no i estimate HubShout functionality at the begining for 600h (it should be definitelly less)
[15:33:36 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Oh you mean the Admin, Manager and Employee Panel that my other Programmers have made can be redeveloped in 3 months?
[15:33:52 CEST] Nikhil Jain: how many hours do you calculate in 1 month? 160 Hours? approx?
[15:34:28 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes 160h
[15:34:35 CEST] Nikhil Jain: I don't think it should take that much time though. They didn't take this much time.
[15:34:48 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But I know you are just giving an approx figures.
[15:34:55 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: yes
[15:34:59 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But again they are very cheap programmers.
[15:35:21 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Do you think we can be in some kind of agreement where you guide my Indian Programmers with Everything as you have more experience doing all of this.. but I know they are good programmers too (they have experience handling APIs too and they say they have even developed an API all by themselves as well) but still I do no trust them too much with this project as they don't have any knowledge about SEO.
[15:37:23 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: how this cooperation will looks like?
[15:38:31 CEST] Nikhil Jain: You might charge something for your consultancy fee and give them all procedure about how to proceed with everything and the step by step process may be
[15:39:11 CEST] Nikhil Jain: They are of course good programmers too. And this is just a suggestions if we can be in some agreement like this, we might work completely with you as well
[15:39:18 CEST] Nikhil Jain: But I mean that way this project can turn out to be really cheap.
[15:39:43 CEST] Nikhil Jain: They charge like 3-4 USD/hour or may be even less which you know how cheap it is ;)
[15:40:15 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: i know
[15:41:57 CEST] Nikhil Jain: The Admin, Manager and Employee Panel that you see - they charged me 1.5 USD/Hour for that for that quality of system. For which your company might want to charge at leats 15 USD/hour.
[15:42:36 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: You need to talk with Anna about this because i am only respond for calculations and project estimation and we cannot made any decisions for project managers
[15:44:45 CEST] Nikhil Jain: Sure. Can you please give a breif about all of this to anna?
[15:44:55 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: ok
[15:45:03 CEST] adamczewski.polcode: thats not the problem
[15:45:07 CEST] Nikhil Jain: And then I can talk further with her about pricing and everything. Ask if we can have you do consultancy thing.. or have you develop the complete thing.
[15:50:17 CEST] Nikhil Jain: So you can let me know when you are done talking to her and I will talk to her then.Add a code snippet to your website: www.paste.org